Welcome to Cloudlandia

Ep110: Discovering True Value in an Age of Convenience

November 16th, 2023

In today's episode of Welcome To Cloudlandia, Dan and I explore Ontario, Canada, alongside a discussion of groundbreaking research on an immortality gene. A doctor shares insights into pinpointing this gene's phenomenal potential for humanity. Lightheartedly, we touch on frequent flyer miles and a Buenos Aires stem cell treatment trip.

Shifting to business, we analyse the impactful Working Genius model's six elements -
Enablement and

There are a lot of nuggets in this episode that prompt us to reevaluate what truly enriches our world.



  • We discuss the fascinating exploration of an immortality gene found by a doctor, that has the potential to revolutionize human life.

  • We touch on the effects of altitude on our bodies and share some anecdotes about our trips for stem cell treatments.

  • We delve into the Working Genius model and its six elements that foster successful collaborations in business.

  • Mark Lechance and Babs share their experiences with the Working Genius model, emphasizing its practical benefits.

  • We share the thrilling story of Matt, a man of Discernment and Tenacity, who successfully navigated domain name issues to set up a project in real time.

  • We examine the dynamics of travel and connectivity, challenging the notion that convenience and comfort are sources of happiness.

  • We discuss the importance of purpose and meaning in achieving true happiness and explore the future of transportation, including the possibility of human-carrying drones.

  • We analyze the psychological limits of convenience in our modern era, and encourage listeners to reconsider the value of real experiences over convenience.

  • We explore the future of travel convenience, discussing how modern technologies have reduced travel friction and predicting the future of transportation.

  • We discuss the concept of convenience, how it is interpreted differently by different people, and reflect on the emotional experience of convenience.

  • Links:



    (AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors)

    Dean: Mr Sullivan.

    Dan: Thank God, there we go.

    Dean: There we go. Thank God we're recording. Yeah, I don't like the sound.

    Dan: I don't like the sound.

    Dean: There was just an interruption, that's all I don't like the sound of that voice of yours. What's up?

    Dan: Well, I just got a cold, I got a head cold Friday, I think. And here I am. Here I am, though, and I'll use the capability that I have available to me to have a great podcast.

    Dean: There we go. I love it. Well, I missed you last week. I've had a great two weeks. Lots to catch up on.

    Dan: I'm sure you've had it in the last few weeks. Yeah, we did. We were at DaVinci 50 and Sundance. I've never been there before.

    Dean: How did you like?

    Dan: that. Yeah, it's a neat place, it's sort of a neat place, but Babs doesn't operate good at 7,000 feet.

    Dean: Oh, boy, okay.

    Dan: So she has some issues. But, she went and she got a. What's it called? It's an IV that you take that pumps your energy up.

    Dean: Oh, okay.

    Dan: I knew, yeah, so fortunately we had a lot of medical advice around us. A little bit, yeah and they were able to get right on it. She had it, but she wasn't sleeping well and I'm pretty good. I don't have that problem at altitude, but there was a lot of downhill climbing from our room to the. And my knee, which hopefully, and we're off to Buena Cerras, Argentina the first week of November to get stem cell treatment for my knee, so hopefully that'll be done.

    Yeah, yeah, we fly in overnight. They pick us up at the airport, take us right to the clinic and I get an injection in the first hour when I'm there and that's my stem cells coming back at me and the promise is that I will grow a new cartilage.

    Dean: And how long does it take for that to be noticeable?

    Dan: It's about six months until it grows back. That's what I'm told, and there's a protocol of not putting too much stress on it, not to go hog wild.

    Dean: Well, how perfect is that You'll have a new me for your AB of perfect I will Just about, and that's exactly right It'll be on.

    Dan: My birthday will be six and a half months and this will be six months. We go down twice more so that they can check on the progress, and so our frequent flyer miles are going to go up, and it's a long, long flight.

    Dean: Nine hours have you been to Plano Furniture before? I have not.

    Dan: I have not this is the first time and they're I think they're either an hour or two hours ahead of Toronto time. Yeah.

    Dean: One of the things.

    Dan: Yeah, no, they're an hour and a half Exactly. That's so funny, but it's sort of when you look at the map. It's always a shock to me how that, if you go to London Ontario, all of South America sits east of London Ontario. That's wild, isn't it? Yeah, it's amazing Because you think of South America being under North America but it actually curves around to the east and Ecuador. The west coast of Ecuador is the furthest point in South America and that lines up perfectly with London Ontario and, for those who are listening, it's sort of Columbus Ohio, if you think of Columbus.

    Dean: Right, right, right, there you go.

    Dan: Dream of Iowa. Yeah, and Americans, you know Ontario. Where's Ontario? Isn't that near Los Angeles? You?

    Dean: know they have an airport here. It's called Ontario yeah.

    Dan: Ontario Airport. You know. Well, that's great. Well, of course it's east of Ontario, california, but you know we're talking about a province that is basically the size of Western Europe.

    Dean: It's probably the size of Europe, but Ontario.

    Dan: Yeah, I was realizing the vastness.

    Dean: When I got to understand the vastness of Ontario I realized somebody pointed out that you could drive north in Ontario the distance between Toronto and Florida and still be in Ontario. That's pretty big right.

    Dan: And if you did east to west, from Cornwall to Canora, that's basically two cities in Ontario. It's the same distance as Washington DC to Kansas City.

    Dean: Wow, okay, yeah.

    Dan: Well, there we go. That is pretty much about all the Canadians huddled close to the border. 90% of the Canadian population is within 100 miles of the US border.

    Dean: That's great. Well, any big shares from Da Vinci. What's coming down the pipe? You got new me.

    Dan: Yeah, the biggest thing. First of all, richard is a phenomenally good chooser of great speakers. Yeah, and it's always very, very enlightening, if not shocking, some of the research that's being done, and I think we have a couple of doctors who were there. And one of the doctors, doctor doctor West, says that it's pretty clear now that there's a fundamental gene, if you will I'm not sure exactly what the terminology is- but, it's a gene, that's the immortality gene, okay, and they've been able to zero in on it because none of our genes die.

    I mean the body they're in dies, but none of the genes themselves actually die. They're immortal and because we all have them, so all humans have them, and every time a new human being is born, it's basically picking up on a couple of million years of genetic development. Yeah so they know that those are immortal.

    And but in each individual there's a turnoff, there's a series of turnoff mechanisms I'll just use a more understandable term here and they're zeroing in on this. For example, there are life forms that don't die flat, flat, flat, flat. Worms, for example, don't die. You know, they, they just never die.

    And you cut them in half and you can cut them in half, and doesn't matter which half, and they can regrow the other half back. So so you know, I mean, it's just really, it's just really interesting where all this is going. I mean, what's the time frame for this, to discover this? Well, they don't know that, you know. But the bare fact that they're they now think it's possible and that they're experiment way. I just find all that stuff interesting.

    Dean: Yeah, I find it very interesting too. Yeah, that's great.

    Dan: I mean, it's kind of the fact that we can know that DNA exists.

    Dean: I mean the fact that somebody discovered that and I mean it's just, how would you even know to look for something like that? Right, yeah, we take it, you know we're. It's so amazing, the things that I mean that's all happened in the big change from 1975 to 19.

    Dan: They're 2025, you know, I've been really thinking about that.

    Dean: That too, the you know the the biggest change If we take, if we extend out to 2025. I think that period of 1975 to 2025 is going to be, you know, civilization changing yeah you know scope of what's happened here.

    Dan: Yeah, but it's like yeah. Well, my redone it is, that it's the people who benefit from this. It's not going to be worldwide. The next 50 years let's say 2025 to 2075, I think that. I think what we're going to see is massive political and economic change, because there's a there's a point where you wanted to become a powerful technological country.

    And at this point not many have. I mean, if you think of all the countries in the world, the US is clearly, you know, in the lead, and the US has just so many other things going for it.

    You know, it's geography, for one thing, that's, it's really hard to invade the United States. I mean, first of all, 3000 miles of water one way and 5000 miles of water the other way, and then you have the Gulf of Mexico, and then you have Mexico. But Mexico in the 200 miles south of the US border is desert and mountain. It's not a it's not a populated area, and then the North North Canadians were always a threat, but now that they've nationalized pot, that's that's neutralizing that.

    Right and Canada. Weren't we going to invade the United?

    Dean: States. I think the US looks at Canada, the natural resource reserve tank attached to their northern border.

    Dan: You know well it's, it's. It's America's biggest gated community.

    Dean: You know right.

    Dan: You have to check in at the gate you know, they make you check in at the gate and you can't bring in guns and they want to know if you have any alcohol. They want to know if you have any tobacco. They're not interested in you if you have any new ideas.

    Dean: Yeah, so you'll love this. I've got four C's that I've observed here, looking for the next 25 years and the I observe that, but you're going to tell me about that in the next podcast, right? Oh, I can tell you about it right now. Here we go.

    Dan: All right.

    Dean: So the first is increase, and I love how you always say increasing, as taken this from you, but increasing connectivity with the farthest outposts of the mainland. That is going to be a big driver of the next 25 years. I think we can if we're guessing and betting. That's where that's what I was thinking about, if I'm guessing what's going to happen in the 25 years. What can I bet on?

    And I bet on increasing connectivity with the farthest outposts of the mainland and that I don't think you can go wrong and I think that, as the technologies are evolving, that will facilitate that connection. That's going to be a big thing. I saw something dance. You know I haven't really been so on board with the metaverse and then I saw and I don't know whether you saw it the most recent video of Lex Friedman and Mark Zuckerberg having a chat in the metaverse with the latest version of the Facebook Visual avatar development where it creates a photo, realistic version of you, three dimensional, in your inner three dimensional space, and you could tell I mean first watching it on the video it's stunningly realistic and impressive.

    But you could tell that that Lex Friedman even said he's having an emotional experience. This is so uncanny that he's got the you know, the new meta headset on, but his feeling is like he's 100% for real in the room with Mark Zuckerberg, like literally having a real conversation with a real person, and that I think that's the first I've seen of what potentially could be what comes here. You know, because it was really, it was really pretty stunning. When you're watching the video, I'll send you the, I'll send you the link, unless you've already seen it.

    Dan: No, no, I haven't. This is the first I've heard of it.

    Dean: Okay, so they have. They basically have a. They split the screen like a try screen where you can see Lex or Mark with the headset on, like where they really are talking and what they're saying. Then they show the middle version, which is kind of the digitized version of what's happening, like all the without the shell on it kind of thing, and then they show the final, the real thing, and it look, if you just look at the visual thing, you would never be able to detect that this is not real. And that's the first that I've seen where there's no latency, there's no, you know, telltale, you know mismatching of the mouth movements or the eye movements or anything like that.

    If you just saw the third version of it, you would think that's really Mark Zuckerberg in real time talking and that's really Lex Friedman, and so that was like that opened my eyes to and they were just kind of in a, you know, a black background kind of thing, like in almost this. They're in a black, like on the Charlie Rose show or something you know, just their things. But you can imagine in, you know, giving fast forward into 2025, the overlaid on any visual environment. You could place them in at table 10, at jocks, you know, or at the select bistro and they're surrounded and, having that experience, I literally.

    I would. I would put because you know what, I've said it and you've said it that I don't really have any interest in putting on the goggles because I haven't seen an environment that's real. You know, but if I could put on those goggles and have a real table 10 experience with you, I would put on the goggles.

    Dan: That was that impressive, you know so that means I have to agree. No, it's one of the things I you know I'm I'm taking your description of it as real, but yeah, I haven't had the experience so I don't really know, you know yeah.

    Dean: So, anyway, I'll check it, I'll check it out, and yeah so there's the first, that's the first C for guessing embedding connectivity, connectivity, that then that I think, if I'm guessing, embedding on the next 25 years our increasing capabilities, both on demand and on cap. You know, I think if we look at the capabilities that AI is going to provide for us, I'm starting, you're starting to see now the real applications of this. Where you take these, these avatar technologies of being able to create your own digital avatar. I fully believe, now that that is going to be in detect undetectable difference between the real, I mean a digital representation, the real video that I had performed, or a digital AI have done it. So those, all those capabilities on demand, along with and if those are not, capabilities on demand through connectivity with the farthest outreaches of the mainland to every other human that's out there, you know, for the special, for the special things you know well not every other human being, but just the one.

    You know, the ones the ones who are on the main, the ones who are connected in cloud land you know, because, because I believe in Dunbar's law, that we only have emotional capability for at most about 150.

    Dan: Yeah. I mean everybody. First of all, I can't comprehend what everybody means, you know. I know Dean and I know Joe and I know. And you guys use up all my time. You know I don't have time.

    Dean: I was just going to say thankfully, we're solidly entrenched in each other's top 150. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

    Dan: I mean the other, the other eight, you know eight billion plus right, I mean I, I'm told they exist, but they don't really have that much. They don't have a place in my future, that much.

    Dean: Yeah, right, right.

    Dan: Yeah.

    Dean: I love it.

    Dan: And then the number three.

    Dean: Number three, yes, yeah collaboration that's going to lead to better and better and better collaboration opportunities with both humans and technology. I can't wait to reach your how to treat technology like a well-trained dog or whatever.

    Dan: What is it like?

    Dean: Like a great dog Like a great dog.

    Dan: Yeah, I own owning technology like a great dog.

    When is that coming out?

    Dan: Oh, it's out.

    Dean: It's out, oh it is.

    Dan: Yeah, you should have gotten a notice in the email that you can download the ebook. Okay, I'll see you about that.

    Dean: Yeah, I think that's fantastic. I had on the collaboration front. I had a really amazing widget extension. I've had a great experience this past couple of weeks here. The widget, of course, the working genius model, I see how useful. This is now in collaboration.

    Dan: We've got three of our team members trained as facilitator or training other people to use working genius. The moment you told me about it, I looked it up. We have the same UNI or the same we have the same. We're inventors and we're discerners. Babs is an inventor, is that yours?

    Dean: No, I'm DI your ID. I mean, I imagine it's the same thing, but Babs is what?

    Dan: She's IG, she's a galvanizer. Okay, yeah, right yeah, and I'm proof of it.

    Dean: So that's great, that's the perfect thing. That's your secret formula, right there.

    Dan: Yeah, I'm proof of it. Yeah, she galvanized me.

    Dean: Yeah, and so I had a really great experience with Mark Litchett. Why don't?

    Dan: we explain to those who don't know what we're talking about Sure Okay.

    Dean: So Mark, of course, unless you want to Go? Ahead.

    Dan: No, go ahead.

    Dean: Okay, so this was introduced to me by James Drage and James introduced this working genius model and you can find it at workinggeniuscom and it's one of the most useful assessments that I've ever come across, right Right up there with Colby, because I think I would rank them. Probably I would rank widget at the top, colby second, and I also like I find Myers-Briggs very useful, but I know you're not as big a fan of Myers-Briggs as I am. But the way that workinggenius works is that we all have workinggenius, which are things that we find effortless, really coincides with our unique ability, really harmonizes with all the strategic coach concepts and the idea is that every team needs, every collaboration, needs somebody in each of the six elements and the six calls spell out the word widget.

    So W is for wonder, someone who can look at something and see all the ways that this could be improved or where could we go with this. Then I is invention, which is making stuff up. There's a lot of I's in strategic coach. It would probably be, you know. Also, they would correlate with being quick starts, I'm sure.

    G is for discernment, the ability to look at options and know what the right thing to do is, to have a highly confident ability in discerning that this is the right thing to do. G is galvanizing, which is someone who has a genius for gathering all the people and elements that are needed to get something accomplished. E is for enablement, which is someone who can support the people who are doing the thing to make sure that everybody has everything they need to complete the task. And T is for tenacity, and tenacity is someone who has a high follow through, who makes things happen and takes things all the way to completion, so fast forward. I'm in a boardroom in Boca Raton with Mark Lechance and some of his team and I had this amazing experience of Isn't that amazing.

    Dan: We just had a metaverse experience because I'm the one that started the call with the cold, but now you have the cold?

    Dean: Yeah, I think mine is. I'm out in my courtyard and I can tell that our pollen count is very high right now, but anyway, I'm sitting there and I noticed how there's one of the guys on well, there were six of us in the room, but Mark Lechance is a galvanizer with invention, a galvanizer invention and I'm starting to identify like the one sentence summary of what these things are. So, mark's like one word, one sentence, like super power is gathering people, gathering the capabilities that you guys are super smart. Here's what I think we could do, you know, like this inventing all the coming up with ideas or the things that could be done.

    Then there was a gentleman there, matt, who is a D, he's a, he's got discernment and tenacity and my observation of that is that he would see something and say that's a good idea, and then the next word out of his mouth were done and he, like we were talking about something, we, you know, I came up, I was, you know, discernment and invention is my thing and I came preloaded with this is what I think we should do. We were doing, we have a VCR, vision capability, reach opportunity with one of the projects that Mark runs, and I came in already preloaded with here's the ideas. Well, I think we should do, which was, you know, it's a really great, great idea and we, you know, came up with the domain name, the whole thing, and literally right there in the, in the meeting you know, matt went and bought the domain name, set up like all these things are happening in real time and getting making something real you know, and so it was really amazing to see that, that collaboration between you know, the widget experience there.

    And I see now, like I realized, galvanizing that I would have guessed that Babs is a galvanizer, because that has been. You know that. That's the, that's the main thing that drives your ability to get your ideas into real world things. It's galvanizing the unique ability, teamwork of everybody on your, on your team, yeah.

    Dan: Yeah, and she just knows how to create team. I mean she, she knows how to create team leaders, she knows how to create teams and the teams have their, you know, they have their projects and they have their goals. And you know they have their measure measurements and everything like that, but one of the one of the things I've noticed about Babs is that she doesn't really comprehend the impact that she has just by being in the room.

    Dean: Yeah, I mean, how do you observe that?

    Dan: How do? You see, no, no, things just happen when she's in the room. Yeah, and in any situation, if you were somewhere with Babs and they had to get something done and within about an hour or two hours she'd be, she would be chosen as the leader.

    Dean: Right.

    Dan: Without her saying anything.

    Dean: Right yeah, right, right, right yeah.

    Dan: I mean, I mean she's six foot two and that helps you know, because she has a core. But you know, often, frequently, she's the tallest person in the room, but she just has a, she has command in her strength. Yeah, Command is number one. Yeah, you know. She just basically says okay, let's get started, let's get something done here.

    And you know, and you know I mean that's my life is divided into two parts before I met Babs and after I met, after I was with Babs. Yeah, and you know, it's just real clear that I'm just always highly motivated when I'm around here.

    Dean: Yeah, what are you looking at? Yeah.

    Dan: I'm looking at you, I remember you telling me and we're in the 42nd year of AAMD. Oh, that's funny, yeah, yeah.

    Dean: Okay.

    Dan: You've done you've. You've gotten three. What's number four?

    Dean: Okay, so the fourth is convenience that we're observing less and less friction in day to day interactions and mainland to Plumlandia, you know communication. So convenience, you know. I remember I think in 2016 or something, I read that article that I've shared about the tyranny of convenience and how we start to see it's a never ending, you know, desire to make things easier and better and ratcheting those advancements without going backwards. You know, and that's really I think, if I were to guess and bet on things being more convenient, increasingly convenient, over the next 25 years, I think we're going to be. I think that's a good bet and you know, you start to see that.

    I think that, as we're, we're already seeing things like you know, one click ordering from Amazon. That's now gotten into. You know, apple Pay and Google Pay and Amazon Pay you never there's no need to ever type your credit card into anything to buy online. But I see how that's going If we chart out where the room in convenience is. I also see, I see companies like Rocket Mortgage, you know, foreshadowing where we're headed, that when we start seeing everybody's got access to all of the data we're all going to be, you know, pre-underwritten in background.

    For anything we're going to have some, you know, available capital or available credit, you know pre-assigned already. You know that we literally will be able to push a button and get approval instantly for whatever we want, and I believe that the blockchain and smart contracts and all of these things are going to make things more and more convenient over the next 25 years, and that's where I've gotten so far. Those, so the connectivity yeah Well, I think they're good. So connectivity- Number one ��로 liability Number two.

    Elaboration number three. Elaboration and convenience, convenience. Uh-huh, it's good, I think those are, and there's probably more. Well, you know those are the first, uh, first four.

    Dan: Yeah, I wouldn't push it beyond four. Make the others be servants of the first four.

    Dean: Yeah.

    Dan: Yeah, yeah, you know. One of the things is. So what's the role of uh? Travel that takes time, it's the uh. I'm asking you a question here.

    Dean: Yeah, I think it's the. Uh, what's the? What's the?

    Dan: what's the role of travel that takes time?

    Dean: The physical, First of all. It happens?

    Dan: Travel happens in the mainland because if I can just, of course, if I can just click or have a thought and I'm so yeah and I'm meeting somewhere else, then it hasn't required travel. And it doesn't, it doesn't take time. So, and I think that that's where?

    Dean: Yeah, so the you know the inconvenience of travel is what is? Two things. That's inconvenient and it happens at the speed of reality. You have to move your, your, your meat puppet from one out.

    Dan: Yeah, I, I'm going to call you that. I think that's. I think that's a bad term.

    Dean: The meat.

    Dan: And I think it diminishes your body and the one thing I want to tell you about, about virtual reality. You're only using sight and sound. You're only using sight and sound. You're not using touch, you're not using taste and you're not. You know, and my sense is that actually, sight and sound make up about less than 10% of what the body actually uses to function. Okay, so, I can understand why my Mark Zuckerberg wants to be in another realm because he can't be speed. He's trying to find a place where he can't be subpoenaed.

    Dean: You know so.

    Dan: Right, right, yeah. And I understand that because he doesn't look like a human being who does well in terms of relationship and you know, and everything else, and I can understand why he wants to find another realm to do it, but we've got a million years of actually creating value out of things that take time and things that you know you have to travel over distance. Okay.

    Dean: Yeah.

    Dan: I don't think there, I don't. I can't sum up all that just as inconvenience, Right yeah. I mean learning doesn't. Learning doesn't happen instantaneously, learning happens over time. Yeah, so I'm just the American as you put the four things.

    As you put the four things together, I'm saying, yeah, but you know, when I go on a long trip, you know, for example, it takes two and a half hours for us to drive to the cottage. Okay, yeah, and I've been interested in plots during those two and a half hours that I wouldn't have if I just touched a button and I was in the cottage.

    Dean: Right, yeah, you think that part of the experience of it is the fact that it took a long time to get there.

    Dan: Yeah there was a price. There was a price for it.

    Dean: Yeah, you know yeah.

    Dan: And if I agree, yeah. So yeah, I'm, I'm. I don't have the answer to this. I'm asking the question. I don't have the answer. I have the answer to it yeah. But I'm noticing that convenience and comfort don't necessarily make people happy. Uh huh, I think purpose and meaning make people happy. You know achievement combined with purpose and meaning.

    Dean: And my experience is.

    Dan: That takes a bit of time. That takes a bit of time.

    Dean: And so yeah. Well, that makes a lot of sense. I mean there's so, um, yeah, that does it makes a lot of sense. And these are just uh. So I do, I'm looking at, no, I think they're they're available.

    Dan: I think what you're saying is that actually they all come under the heading of capability. You know it's obviously a huge jump in capability, because connectivity and um and uh uh, collaboration and uh and uh and convenience are great capabilities, you know, and I think people are always striving for greater capabilities.

    Dean: I agree, yeah, yeah, yeah. There's something there's always going to be real. There's always going to be a higher value on on real.

    Dan: Yeah.

    Dean: I believe that we're definitely missing out. You know, and it's not by an order of just a small percentage, I mean, it's exponentially different. I think you know um say say what?

    what I think in the convenience, yeah when I was going to convenience things is that I think that the ability to make that travel, which is still highly valuable, being present in in a place is still highly valuable, um, but the elimination of friction in in doing that To the extent that you can, is going to be, I think, a safe bet.

    Uh, when you look at I it was, it was funny, we were, I was having a conversation with someone about the the newest travel trend. Uh, in mainstream travel is the private terminals that are popping up now, like at LAX there's was the first one that I heard of where you can bypass the, the main terminal. You go to a private terminal where you pull up, they valet park your car, you go into a suite that's got, you know, just a food and whatever you allow Comfortable for you to wait for your flight. You go through security, everything that's necessary, checking in the whole thing, and then, when it's time they drive you in, you know a BMW or an SUV, they drive you to on the ramp, to those where the plane is, take you up and put you on your on your seat and off you go, and that level of friction, skipping from the curb to the gate, that's what everybody is. That's where all the the hassle of of mainland travel is once you're on the plane.

    Nobody's mad at the first class cabin of any airliner. It's comfortable, it's. The seats are great, the food is great, the you know the environment. Everything about it is is fine. You get to your, your destination. It's just all the inconvenience from the curb to the gate. You know that we're all the we're all the thing is now.

    Now, and I also think, like recently, as you start seeing, I think it's pretty clear we're going to end up in a human carrying drone world where that, you know, drone flight is going to be, you know, for shorter, and it's going to be a two hour drive into a 20 minute, you know, taxi, drone, taxi type of environment. I think we'll see that in the next 25 years. I think that's a that'd be a pretty safe bet.

    Dan: I'll let you bet that it doesn't happen, okay, yeah.

    Dean: Good and that's interesting. So why? What makes? You think that, that, that it won't happen.

    Dan: Well, first of all, I don't think the capital is going to be there over the next 25 years, because capital money is getting very, very expensive and it's a function of the fact that transportation is getting very, very expensive. So when you have transportation very expensive, it makes money really expensive, it makes energy really expensive and it makes labor really expensive.

    Dean: And I don't think.

    Dan: First of all, I've never you may be the first person I've ever talked to had that as an aspiration or as a future thought, and my sense is that the next things to get invented is where there's like an 80% aspiration in the marketplace. We'd like to have this, you know, and you know, and I think the Amazon has done well, because there's an 80% wish that last minute purchasing or last minute shopping could be eliminated.

    Dean: Yeah, there's, there's something. I think that's true.

    Dan: Yeah, but one of the ways I've gone in the opposite direction, I've just eliminated all need for meetings that require travel.

    Dean: Yeah, me too. How is the travel industry doing? So I would say that that's more of an aspirator.

    Dan: I would say that's more of an aspiration than making travel comfortable. I would say not traveling at all is more of an aspiration. And, yeah, traveling with the least amount of friction.

    Dean: I agree and that's what I think would fit in with convenience. Well, I think we started going down that path. That was, I think that in every, in every way, in every element, I think convenience is really a driver right. That that's kind of we're definitely looking for things to be here and less friction.

    Dan: Let's look at the word convenience, because I think everybody's got a different notion of what constitutes convenience. You know, and I think it's is entirely defined by your situation in the mainland. I mean it only has been in relationship to the, to the. To the mainland I mean that my Apple computer comes on. It takes me, you know, five seconds to get on and I could do it in a second. I really don't care. I really don't care, you know right the five no five seconds.

    The five seconds seems good enough for me, you know I don't, I don't need it.

    So first of all, I think there's a point where convenience, or the striving for convenience, has a diminishing return. You know, because even at your personal airport, you know your private personal airport let's say that pretty soon there's going to be a desire on the ideal jet that there's a first class and the second class Right, and people, people say, well, why are they up there and we're, we're back here and you've got every convenience in the world. But because it's all psychological I mean all everything we're talking about here is psychological. You know, pricey psychological.

    Dean: And.

    Dan: I just feel that my notion of convenience may be different from your notion of convenience, you know. I mean if we went down step by step and we took our daily life and we went through, and everything like having food delivered to my house doesn't interest. Well, first of all, by all, my food is delivered by house by one person. You know we have a caterer and yes, but, but I can name on two hands. A number of times we've ordered in from a you know a restaurant, you know so that doesn't fall in my area of convenience, right yeah.

    Dean: Yeah.

    Dan: The other aspect about it is that traveling not under compulsion, in other words, I'm not compelled to travel, but just getting out and driving around. I find that interesting.

    Dean: Yeah, even like going up to the cottage or going.

    Dan: yeah, yeah, I find it interesting and you know, we have a halfway stop at Tim Hortons where we've never eaten, but we've always peed. The restroom is always in the same place. It's always clean. It's great. My definition of Tim Hortons in Canada is where white people go to get whiter.

    Dean: Have you ever experienced webbers? No, we go up to 404.

    Dan: We're heading to the east. We're not heading to the east. We've been on 400 and I've passed it, but the line up looked inconvenient.

    Dean: Well, you know it was quite a thing that they did was because that was kind of like the official stopping point of the way up to Muscova. That everybody would, you know, friday night stop and get a burger at Webbers. And then they brought in a great extent an overpass. They bought the land across before the oh no yeah. They brought in a great expense on an overpass that you could.

    Dan: Well, they could put in another parking lot. That's why they did it.

    Dean: Yeah, it's now convenient to stop on your way home, because it was super inconvenient.

    Dan: It's really interesting the I just want to zero in on the idea that convenience is uniquely defined. I think you're right. So I think a lot of the technology people make a guess that everybody is going to enjoy a new level of convenience that they're creating and they're generalizing they have to generalize human nature, that everybody's going to like this. I think it's a form of projection on the part of the inventors that, because they find it convenient to everybody else, only 16% of technology startups succeed.

    The thing, so it means that 84% of them. Yeah, I would say that most technologies are created to satisfy some form of convenience. Yeah, I would say.

    Dean: There's some definitions of convenience. I would love to go to the source here and see. So. Convenience is the state of being able to proceed with something with little effort or difficulty.

    Dan: Well, you and I are great believers in that.

    Dean: Yeah, the quality of being useful, easy or suitable for someone. And then the third is a thing that contributes to an easy and effortless way of life. Yeah, and so? I think, that that's going, no matter what you're doing, to making. I would argue that the virtual division of Strategic Coach has made it, through convenience, a possibility for people in what would otherwise be inconvenient parts of the world to participate.

    Dan: Yeah, and I think that you may. Zoom has, zoom has. Zoom has Zoom has. Yeah, my sense is that they Do. They need much more than Zoom. Do they need to actually have the feeling that they're?

    Dean: there. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, we're not going to be able to.

    Dan: I mean to be tested, yeah, to be experiment, tested.

    Dean: I was just like you know. You know just at what appeared to be what was literally appearing in this thing. So that was. I'm just reporting the news.

    Dan: Yeah and yeah, I know he seemed real, but is he real?

    Dean: Yeah, and I was only seeing a 2D. I'm only seeing the 2D example of it, right? So, yeah, I can't imagine what it would be like. If you Like Lex Friedman's response to it I don't know who he- is.

    Dan: by the way, I don't know who this person is.

    Dean: Lex Friedman is a very popular podcaster, similar in popularity as Joe Rogan, like that level, one of the top interview podcasters, very smart, intelligent guy. But yeah, this was His visibly, you know the visible reaction that he was having to. It was like he was having a hard time really describing the impact, the emotional experience that he was having of this and he's a pretty non-emotional guy. That's part of the you know the term he's of.

    Dan: Yeah.

    Dean: Yeah, well, I'm going to have.

    Dan: I'm going to have to have the experience I'm going to have to. The experience you know yeah.

    Dean: Yeah.

    Dan: By the way, that whole.

    Dean: You know us being able to. It's just so funny to think now of all of these things, like I just see the layering, of this constant improvement in understanding of both our unique abilities and the unique capabilities that are being presented to us and the convenience of collaboration. Did you watch 60 Minutes? Yeah, you don't watch any TV, so there was.

    Dan: I am innocent of the experience.

    Dean: Do you know who Rick Rubin is? He's a music producer. He's regarded as maybe the oh, no, no.

    Dan: I've watched his YouTubes. I've watched his YouTubes. Yeah, he's a great guy, yeah.

    Dean: Really, he plays guitar.

    Dan: He plays guitar right.

    Dean: No, he doesn't. He doesn't play anything, which is really.

    Dan: Which is really impressive. Somebody else that I'm thinking of he does a really great job of telling you why a song works or how a song works and everything.

    Dean: Yeah, yeah.

    Dan: Yeah, he's a white hair. Yeah, I'm looking at white hair.

    Dean: Looks like Nafuzela. He's the no. You're talking about Rick Beato.

    Dan: He's the guy you're talking about yeah, that's who I'm, that's what.

    Dean: I'm talking about. Yeah, no, rick Rubin looks like Nafuzela, he's got a beard and long hair, real zen kind of guy. But he was on 60 Minutes with Anderson Cooper and it was pretty. There's some great sound bites from it. Because Anderson Cooper was asking him well, what is it that you do? Can you play instruments? And Rick said barely Could you work a sound board? And he said I have no technical ability and I know nothing about music, like actual music things. And Anderson asked him well, what do you get paid for? And he said he thought for a second and said the confidence that I have in my case and my ability to express what I feel has proven helpful for artists. And I thought there's a guy, if we were to do a widget on him, I'm sure he's a GI, I'm sure he has discernment and invention as his two things.

    You can see, this is a good idea, this is the big idea here, and this is what I think you should do.

    Dan: You have a visitor in the recording.

    Dean: It's a crow. I think it's funny.

    Dan: Don't you know that you're sitting. Don't you know that you're occupying his space? I?

    Dean: must be.

    Dan: Yeah, he's trying to tell you to get out. This is my space, Anyway it's all interesting. I keep coming back to the whole concept of the difference between convenience and comfort, and purpose and meaning. Yeah because my limousine company that I have in Toronto oftentimes has these sort of elite lifestyle magazines that advertises places to go and none of the people look happy. Yeah they look true.

    They look like they look like they've got everything they want, and that hasn't made them happy. You know, they look. They look sophisticated, they're obviously wealthy and they have this, but it hasn't done the trick. You know, it's like models. It's like models you know like in Vogue magazine. Babs gets some of the magazines and the Wall Street Journal once a month has a style magazine that comes with one of the additions and they all look well.

    First of all, I could draw a thought bubble above all their heads and say what I would give for a burger and fries, right, I mean, they look just, you know, they just look so unhappy and yeah, but they're representing the top of the world in fashion. You know, the elite living there are the top and I said, yeah, but they're, it's absent. It's absent meaning and purpose. You know, you've achieved something but and and people will sacrifice enormous amount of inconvenience for purpose and meaning.

    So it's an interesting discussion, isn't it? No, I mean, I take it may. I'm not a cutting edge guy with technology, but when I hear enough of other people talking about things that seems to work, I said why don't we just include this? And you know, and. I'm really driven by productivity. I like getting a lot of stuff done easier and faster, you know. But it's the thing that is being achieved, that has meaning and purpose. It's not the means of getting there. So yeah.

    Dean: I think there's a good, no, it's an interesting this thing is you know, yeah, and we live in totally a lot of the world.

    Dan: We do.

    Dean: I think that's part of the thing is maybe the, the harmonizing of that is pointing convenience at the end of comfort or out of purpose and meaning. Yeah, to make speaking purpose and meaning more convenient there, there's a new special on Netflix called Blue Zones and it's yeah observation of Okay talk about it.

    Yeah, and those things, those people, inevitably. They live very simple lives about much adornment. They've got the if you guy, as the Japanese would say, the purpose, you know the meaning that, the thing that brings them joy, connection to people. They love Community, but that's all.

    Dan: But if you think of your six Right.

    Dean: Yeah, they're very simple.

    Dan: They get rid of the eye. They'd wipe out the eye people really fast.

    Dean: Exactly. A mill that's 150 years old.

    Dan: I found from their great great grandmother you know, yeah, yeah, there's a famous temple in Japan. This will be.

    I have to jump right now afterwards, but there's a temple in that every 20 years it's totally torn down and rebuild again. Okay, and this has been happening now for 2000 years. So every 20, that's 100 times, 100 times, wow, and, and, and they have to find wood that's exactly like the wood you know that, the original or the existing one they have to replace with the same kind of woods. There's no mechanical parts of the temple, it's all done with drilling, with ancient yeah and everything they use now.

    The light screws, yeah, everything like that, and and an American coming into contact with this experience would say why? Why do you do it? Why don't you do it the next time? Why don't you build something different? You know, and, and I said because they have created enormous meaning and purpose out of something that's always the same.

    Dean: Yeah.

    Dan: So you know, convenience is a capability, but it's not the really purpose. It's not the ruling me. Right, convenience is not the ruling me. That's a discussion I like you yeah, I really, of course. Let's have a four C's dual. Let's have a four C's dual one, okay, when you do your first free zone with you and I will have a dual in the front of the room between your four C's and my four C's.

    Dean: Okay, there we go. I like it.

    Dan: Well, one of them is the same because we have capability and common, and I think capability is the master one.

    Dean: Yeah, and you're not. You don't think collaboration there. You're putting collaboration as a capability.

    Dan: Yeah, yeah, I think the other three are actually, I think capability is the center of your four C's and the other three are enhanced capabilities. Connectivity, collaboration and convenience are always being developed new in the world. I love it All right.

    Dean: Okay, thank you. Well, always great, dan. I'll look forward to next week.

    Dan: Yeah, and I'll be on the way home from the cottage next Sunday, so I won't be able to so to be the Sunday after.

    Dean: Okay, no problem, two weeks Okay yeah.

    Dan: Okay, okay, okay, thanks have a great time, bye-bye. Okay, bye.

    Dean: Bye.